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LTBcoin A Ponzi?

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Andaloons

Strange discussion is going on in this reddit post. Are some people butthurt by LTBcoin??

I'm confused by the attitude of malaise.

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  • pooktwo

    @andaloons Strange discussion is going on in this reddit post. Are some people butthurt by LTBcoin??

    I'm confused by the attitude of malaise.

    I just read through the forum, every idea is going to have some people disagree with. I think they are misinterpreting the concept of LTBCOIN as a currency when i see it more as a reward point system.

    Haters always gonna hate

    • Robert Ross
    • Director of FoldingCoin Inc
    • Community Director for the Counterparty Foundation
    • Skype: foldingcoin
    • Twitter: @pooktwoFLDC
    • FLDC Twitter: @foldingcoin
    • Email: rross@foldingcoin.net
    • Alt Email: foldingcoin.net@gmail.com
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  • Goefells

    There is one comment talking about the nature of LTBCoin and content creation--the aim was to bootstrap a community and content creators together through some reward based system. This, it hoped, would create a viable audience for advertising and cycle up content creation. Since joining LTB there is definitely much less content on the site in written format, and while there are a lot more podcasts, not many people can sit at their desks for an hour or so to listen.

    An interesting article can take 20 minutes to read.

    I dunno, I kind sorta agree with that commenter--what exactly has happened to the LTBC experiment? Has it now become fully embraced in a Tokenly fashion? It's not content that is important, it's merchandise and services now built on top of Tokenly that utlise LTBCoin?

    Instead of diverse content for the audience, are we merely shoppers now with a little bit of content side dish? I don't particularly mind how LTBCoin is used, it's always been about the content here for me(have not ever sold a single LTBCoin :P), but what is exactly happening with the LTBCoin experiment? Is Tokenly a pivot which has dragged LTBCoin with it?

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  • heunland

    @goefells There is one comment talking about the nature of LTBCoin and content creation--the aim was to bootstrap a community and content creators together through some reward based system. This, it hoped, would create a viable audience for advertising and cycle up content creation. Since joining LTB there is definitely much less content on the site in written format, and while there are a lot more podcasts, not many people can sit at their desks for an hour or so to listen.

    An interesting article can take 20 minutes to read.

    I dunno, I kind sorta agree with that commenter--what exactly has happened to the LTBC experiment? Has it now become fully embraced in a Tokenly fashion? It's not content that is important, it's merchandise and services now built on top of Tokenly that utlise LTBCoin?

    Instead of diverse content for the audience, are we merely shoppers now with a little bit of content side dish? I don't particularly mind how LTBCoin is used, it's always been about the content here for me(have not ever sold a single LTBCoin :P), but what is exactly happening with the LTBCoin experiment? Is Tokenly a pivot which has dragged LTBCoin with it?

    I disagree, I think there is plenty of content on LTB also in written form. Just recently a new blog was added called the Africoin Report. I don´t personally feel like a shopper on LTB Network.

    All opinions expressed on this forum are my own and should not be interpreted as official statement of any company or project in particular.

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  • davidareallen

    For those that want to see the comments without going to Reddit:

    Does anyone remember when LTB tried to promote their own crypto currency? (self.Bitcoin)

    submitted 12 hours ago by utuxia

    ....how'd that work out?

    91 comments share all 91 comments sorted by: top

    [–]future_greedy_boss 17 points 8 hours ago

    Planet Money on NPR did like half a dozen episodes where they made their own t-shirts to promote the show, but instead of just buying a trailer of them from some alibaba one-stop shop they did it the hard way, manually ordering and tracking every single piece of the shirt from the raw plucked cotton up to through the fabric weaving, stitching, logo printing, and all the guts in between like shipping materials around the globe. The point of the series wasn't to sell shirts (which would have happened anyway) but to explore the subject of economic globalization from a hands-on perspective.

    I see nothing wrong with a show trying to illuminate, through hands-on experimentation, the ideas that show talks about every episode. If LTB used Bitcoin itself that would have been interesting too, but it would have much less depth than creating a coin from the bottom up to test out the concepts in a more fundamental way.

    It's not as if they made a fortune off that coin, what's the actual regular unique audience for the show, 10000-15000 people tops? 90% of whom (which is very generous) would never donate money regardless of what coin it was in?

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    [–]cryptonaut420 8 points 45 minutes ago

    It's important to note that LTBCOIN is not your usual alt-coin, which a lot of people seem to believe.

    LTBCOIN is a Counterparty token, built on the bitcoin blockchain. Any LTBCOIN transaction is inherently a bitcoin transaction, sends a small amount of BTC and pays a bitcoin miners fee. There is no separate blockchain and no LTB specific network of miners. It's all just metadata embedded in a series of transactions.

    Counterparty tokens are also known as "user created assets". Colored coins are the same thing. These are somewhat centralized in their nature, because a single person creates an asset and decides it's properties, owner of that private key has the rights to issue new tokens (or lock issuance permanently), and asset owner can do a few other things like pay dividends and change the description. This also sets them apart from your standard bitcoin/litecoin/peercoin clone since it's not actually it's own decentralized network, just multiple user created tokens piggybacking off the bitcoin blockchain, issued by humans.

    So, LTBCOIN is just a community rewards token, it's not a "we think this should become the new world currency", it's more like "here's some funbux for playing on our website, thanks!" (opt-in btw). Tokens are issued on a fixed, publicly available schedule for 5 years (we just entered year 2), and our distributed to community members once per week based on who participated the most or posted the best or the most content. We call this "Proof of Participation" (PoP), as opposed to Proof of Work. All tokens are given away, we have never directly sold any newly issued tokens (even the official LTBCOIN swapbot only sells tokens earned through content creation via the same PoP process)

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    [–]btc5000 10 points 11 hours ago*

    Ltbcoin it's pretty cool, I don't think it was serious though, just fun

    It's not even a coin, it's counterparty

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    [–]cryptonaut420 4 points an hour ago

    This is correct, it's much closer to a fun experiment than it is some serious attempt at making a ton money or trying to compete with bitcoin as a currency or whatever. It's just a humble community rewards token.

    Also yeah it's Counterparty, which means therefore it is Bitcoin.

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    [–]deweller 3 points an hour ago

    It was serious in the sense that we asked people to participate and we continue to put a lot of effort into running the program.

    But, yes, we have had fun along the way for sure.

    (See my extended comment in this thread)

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    [–]haakon 10 points 7 hours ago*

    Remember when they convinced a small artist create her own cryptocurrency, TatianaCoin? A currency that is onlygood for her merchandise etc.

    Andreas often says that in the future, "everybody" will have their own cryptocurrency. Little school children will trade JasonCoin and AmandaCoin instead of candy and stickers.

    I don't believe it, for a second. The universe wants one money, or if not just one, at least not a billion. Economics hates pointless inefficiency, and the idea that cryptocurrency would actually drive such inefficiencies is absurd.

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    [–]cafucafucafu 6 points 4 hours ago

    I have a lot of respect for Andreas. He is a very smart man, but this is one area where he is completely wrong.

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    [–]treebeardd 1 point 2 hours ago

    Not necessarily. Many places have a "local currency." Since bitcoinaltcoin trade is generally quite liquid (probably) I don't see why people wouldn't want to create their own promotional currencies. I'm not saying they will be seriously viable, more like earning points on a credit card or something.

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    [–]grumblegrr 3 points 5 hours ago

    Or monotheism vs polytheism. If each forum can have they own point schem like reddit, google+, phpBB, facebook, we can expect to see internal crypto-currency on very local field of applicaton too. If Tatiana can get her own Coin, it's maybe not very practical for a lot of reason we know, but she is able to do it and that the beauty of it.

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    [–]cafucafucafu 0 points 3 hours ago

    Why does Facebook need crypto? They just need a centralised database.

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    [–]grumblegrr 1 point 3 hours ago

    Facebook probably not at the moment, however we can imagin a dencentralized social network who can use their own blockchain to manage internal currency. Eg: users from independant server A, can trad with users from independant server B.

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    [–]murclock 3 points 3 hours ago

    The 'one money' argument is absurd. In the history of mankind, when has there ever been one and only one currency?

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    [–]haakon 1 point 2 hours ago

    When has there ever been fewer currencies than today? I'm not saying there will ever actually be "one money", but as humanity's capabilities for travel and communication have increased, the number of currencies certainly seems to have decreased. The U.S. had hundreds of currencies before the federal dollar, Europe had many more currencies before the Euro.

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    [–]pdtmeiwn 1 point 1 hour ago

    Before the last 45 years, there was indeed one money through most of history: gold. Everything else was a derivative of gold.

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    [–]murclock 1 point 1 hour ago

    ...and silver, as well as other precious metals among other things. There was never 'one money'.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point 42 minutes ago

    Not to mention it wasn't just "pieces of metal" - it was specific currencies minted for different nations, empires etc.

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    [–]bluelightzero 1 point 4 hours ago

    Who wants 1,000,000 of my BLZCoin?

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point 1 hour ago

    Your assuming that things like TatianaCoin or LTBcoin are in any way attempting to be real world currencies competing with bitcoin. Tokens like these are essentially customer or audience engaging marketing gimicks, not your usual "my HybridFlex super blockchain is going to revolutionize the world!!" type alt-coins.

    Also these are Counterparty tokens which means anyone using TatianaCoin or whatever is also using bitcoin by necessity.

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    [–]rydan -2 points 5 hours ago

    I never understood the purpose of that coin. Plus she works for Bitcoin Magazine which is a huge conflict of interest.

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    [–]Sovereign_Curtis 2 points 3 hours ago

    Plus she works for Bitcoin Magazine

    Huh? You mean because she sometimes authors articles picked up by Bitcoin Magazine, right?

    https://bitcoinmagazine.com/author/tatiana/

    Nothing since February of this year.

    That's totally not "working for"

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    Other than a small group of core members, LTB has no actual staff and all writers and podcasters do so on a voluntary basis (besides getting paid some peanuts in the form of LTBCOIN) and often times submit work through other platforms. Not a problem.

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    [–]deweller 12 points an hour ago

    Disclaimer: I'm a volunteer at the LTB network and a co-founder of Tokenly. Views expressed here are (obviously) my own.

    LTBcoin was and is an experiment at its core.

    The experiment is all about bootstrapping. How do you take a willing but unfunded volunteer community and turn that into a self-sustaining profitable eco-system?

    You could 1) go the traditional route and take venture capital funding. But then you are obligated to your investors who want to see astronomical growth in a short time.

    Or you could 2) follow a crowdfunding model where you presell a specific product. But in this case, the product did not exist yet.

    Or, you could 3) try something new.

    We chose to do number 3. By distributing a currency we gave people a stake in the future of the LTB network. The effort that people put in during the bootstrapping days gives them tokens that may have utility in the future as the network continues to grow.

    Here is a micro-faq:

    Was it a success? LTBcoin is distributed over a 5 year timetable. We have recently passed year 1. This project/experiment is still continuing. We founded Tokenly because we needed additional tools to properly carry out this experiment. But developing these tools takes a non-trivial amount of time. A goal was to learn, explore and grow together as a community. In that sense, it has already been a success. While we have already learned much, in my opinion the experiment is just beginning so it is too early to tell.

    Did this work out perfectly? No. But we have learned and continue to learn along the way.

    What is Tokenly? Tokenly is a startup built to solve the problems we ran into when launching LTBcoin. We found we needed a lot of software. And that takes a lot of time to build. We also thinkg that other people can benefit from these same tools. So we started Tokenly.

    Is there more coming? Yes. The network of podcasts continues to grow. Tokenly is actively building new tools to further this community bootstrapping model. We are just begnning year 2 of a 5 year journey.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 3 points 42 minutes ago

    This post pretty much mirrors my opinion, perhaps unsurprisingly.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 10 points an hour ago

    I just want to be clear that although Andreas Antonopoulos is involved in the Let's Talk Bitcoin show, he isn't really involved in any of my experimentation with tokens, LTBCOIN, the LTB network, Tokenly, etc.

    So feel what you want about the projects but understand that the one responsible for the direction and drive on all of this is me and any contradiction you might see between what I'm doing with these projects and what you think Andreas believes have nothing to do with each other.

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    [–]kukkuzejt 8 points 5 hours ago

    I served as core team member both before and after the launch of LTBCoin and was also managing editor for a time.

    My personal view is that the LTBCoin crash was a direct result of the decision to work too hard and too soon on Tokenly and other side projects at the expense of building up the main LTB content network. Don't get me wrong, Tokenly is an awesome project, but unfortunately it took the wind out of the sails of the core LTB operation, ruining the LTBCoin experiment.

    A little over a year ago (early summer 2014), you had an enthusiastic team of writers and editors at LTB working hard to publish lots of great content. I'm talking of several articles a day, with a publishing backlog slowly building up as the prospect of earning LTBCoin drew in new writing talent.

    LTBCoin drew in a good deal of mediocre writers too, and what was missing and necessary was a well-designed underlying software system to decentralize the writing and editing and make the process scale smoothly as demand grew. This was supposed to happen by building an LTB talent market and reputation system where people could offer their services and be rated based on their work.

    Another crucial thing that got put on the back burner for Tokenly's sake was a drive to get more advertising on the site, including building a planned system where people could easily buy ads with their LTBC or BTC, vending machine style.

    When those things didn't happen, editors (who were already under-compensated compared to writers) started to get fed up and leave, which increased backlog issues and frustrated the writers. This put an end to any chances of getting enough advertising paid in LTBC to give value to the coin, which was the original intention and the whole point at the end of the day.

    That's my 2c.

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    [–]deweller 4 points an hour ago

    Doing it all by hand didn't scale. So we made the decision to build the tools. In our estimation, the best way to build the tools (a multi-year process) was to form a company to fund it.

    In a perfect world, all the tools would have already existed before we started LTBcoin. But then we wouldn't have been able to learn what tools we needed. So it was a chicken-and-egg problem.

    Tokenly was built specifically to solve the problems we ran into while running the LTBcoin rewards program.

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    [–]kukkuzejt 1 point 53 minutes ago*

    That's true, but as I insisted at the time, we should have prioritized the specific tools that would have solved the editing and advertising issues and kept up the momentum with the community that was producing the content.

    Unfortunately, we lost a lot of enthusiastic and talented people, not to mention the results of our own effort, along the way.

    (edit: typo)

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    [–]AdamBLevine 2 points 34 minutes ago

    I've wondered a lot about this recently, I'm not convinced you were wrong, it might have been better to do all development within LTB and focus solely on those needs, but then as now I'm not sure our experiment with LTB will "work" and so the priority stopped being just about LTB.

    If we had chosen to focus on LTB, instead of spending the money on developing technology we would have spent it on some paid staff instead of pure volunteers. Would that have been a better decision? I don't know.

    LTB was the reason and the catalyst for all the things we've built with tokenly, but we built them not just for LTB so that whether LTB succeeds or fails in its own set of experiments (which it always has been to me, although that's not true for everybody) the work that we're doing can continue and be applicable for others who want to try some variation.

    Then as now my contention is that the project has its own pace and people should leave or join based on what they need in their lives at the time. As the platform grows and changes over time you might find that it is again the best place for you to do your work and rejoin while at the same time others will find it has become something that isn't as valuable to them as it once was.

    It's just the way things are, and I'm comfortable with it.

    Incidentally, good to see your words :) It's been an age.

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    [–]ivanbny 7 points 5 hours ago

    Also, can't wait until this thread is shutdown because we can't discuss tokens or altcoins on /r/bitcoin. rolls eyes

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    [–]andyrowe 3 points 2 hours ago

    You can't use the 'A' word. Thought crime! Thought crime!

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    [–]moleccc 5 points 10 hours ago

    That talk about that promo coin of theirs was getting on my nerves. Not enough to make me turn away from their mostly good content though.

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    [–]utuxia[S] 1 point 10 hours ago

    I usually skipped that episode when they went on and on about it.

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    [–]bitesports 5 points 5 hours ago

    It's still working, they're launching a token service called Tokenly, you can hear about it here:https://soundcloud.com/mindtomatter/ltb-e239-solving-problems

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    [–]Lite_Coin_Guy 5 points 11 hours ago

    Was always a bad idea.

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    [–]utuxia[S] 0 points 11 hours ago

    The idea had some appeal, to pay their content providers. But they wanted to control it so they issued their own. Exactly what banks will do.

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    [–]pinhead26 9 points 10 hours ago

    More like issuing stock - exactly what companies do.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    As opposed to setting up a network of miners, building and managing our own fork of bitcoind, and then watching as far less people use it because most people don't actually want to set up a clunky wallet which only works on some obscure blockchain?

    LTBCOIN is a counterparty asset, i.e a meta token which lives on Bitcoin. See here: http://counterparty.io/

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    [–]moeabdol -2 points 11 hours ago

    yeah unfortunately LTB was promoted by Andreas Antonopoulos a guy which I hugely respect

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    [–]AdamBLevine 3 points an hour ago

    Just to correct here, Andreas is a host of the LTB show but I don't really think he can be accurately described as "promoting LTB" or especially "LTBCOIN"

    Andreas just like everybody else who creates content at LTB is an autonomous individual, we don't even have a contract with him and we don't pay him (although he does earn some LTBCOIN rewards when he accepts the collaborator invitation).

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    [–]utuxia[S] 1 point 10 hours ago

    It sounded like some MLM scheme when they talked about LBTCoin on the show.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 3 points an hour ago

    Given that all LTBCOIN is given away... I'd love to hear what part of it struck you as a tier'd sales pyramid?

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    [–]rydan -3 points 5 hours ago

    Andreas promotes a lot of things. Neo & Bee was another thing he promoted.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 3 points an hour ago

    He consulted for Neo and Bee, which is really different than promoting them. He basically stopped doing publicizable consulting (i.e. the client can say that you consulted) because of that and other experiences.

    When you're just a dude and suddenly you're THE Andreas Antonopoulos and people suddenly care a whole lot about your opinions it takes a while to get used to that power. Having that sort of impact means that you never want to actually use it because then everybody says you're abusing it, so if you think about it Andreas isn't even really allowed to have an opinion publicly any more because people will hold him to it.

    I'm incredibly grateful to Andreas for filling the public facing role he does, it's one i've always taken steps to avoid and somebody needs to do it right

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    [–]missdna 1 point 41 minutes ago

    A lot of things? Okay, can you please give a lot of examples?

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    [–]btcsa 5 points 10 hours ago

    I like the shows, and collecting the currency, its fun

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    [–]ivanbny 6 points 5 hours ago

    I don't think that LTB is flat out wrong with the idea that tokens can be useful in microsystems. While I definitely agree that there will be a single universal cryptocurrency there will continue to be situations where it's not the primary token of value.

    Here are examples of 'currencies' already in use which have value only because the participant has no choice but to use them:

    WoW gold American Airlines points Chuck E Cheese tokens Obviously outside of World of Warcraft, in-game tokens aren't much use. But the point is that if you can make your brand and environment valuable enough, you can make your own token valuable too.

    A Facebook coin would at least temporarily be far more popular than Bitcoin, simply because they have 1bn users and can use that environment to bootstrap the value of a token. Long term, I imagine that the rules that Facebook would need to introduce would erode the value vs Bitcoin.

    BTW, I still have a bunch of LTBCoin. Just waiting for some reason to spend them on LTB stuff...Adam - make some t-shirts or mugs!

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    [–]AdamBLevine 3 points an hour ago

    Sooner now than ever before :)

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    [–]bruce_fenton 6 points an hour ago

    I think it's a neat idea and followed it. Adam was pretty clear that this was not designed primarily to be a currency thst would compete with Bitcoin for example but more of an experiment and way to have something of value created by members, listeners and content providers.

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    [–]BitcoinOdyssey 4 points 10 hours ago

    A: Yes

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    [–]frankenmint 3 points 2 hours ago

    I still receive LTB weekly contributions from visiting the site. However, its like I cannot reedeem them until I move forward with the tokenly web browser plugin. I don't know about anyone else, but needing a web wallet browser extension is very offputting and so I have just had them accumulating (at some point I'll sandbox my environment and will run tokenly so i can redeem them). Though like others complain, I don't know if they will ever have any sort of redeemable value. Seems like they can be used to re-buy ad space but nothing more.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 6 points an hour ago

    Just so you know, you definitely don't need to use Tokenly Pockets to control your LTBCOIN. Tokenly Pockets is just more convenient because we've implemented an expanded token payment protocol so that when you click the 'pay' link it loads your wallet in a new browser window (locally on your computer, not served remote) that is preloaded with the payment token, the payment amount, the payment memo and the payment recipient.

    You double check the info and click the "send" button and are presented with a link to see the tx confirm on the blockchain.

    So the reason you'd use Tokenly Pockets is because its more convenient in a lot of ways and we're actively developing it (Joe just added label exports, an expanded token information protocol (you can try it at http://xcp.ninja) and in the next day or so an in-wallet tutorial overlay will be in.

    Tokenly Pockets isn't intended to replace counterwallet at least yet, it's more intended for users rather than powerusers who will find counterwallet more versatile (DEX access and asset creation).

    We built Tokenly Pockets explicitly because Counterwallet was unstable, not being actively developed and not reliable for making transactions under many network circumstances.

    And if you want to take a look at the source, https://github.com/loon3/Tokenly-Pockets

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    [–]murclock 3 points an hour ago

    Tokenly Pockets developer here.

    web wallet browser extension

    "Web wallet" and "browser extension" are mutually exclusive. Browser extensions are applications downloaded and executed locally from your machine. A browser extension can be a front-end to a web wallet (i.e. Blockchain.info's extension) but it doesn't have to be.

    With Pockets, your private key never leaves your machine. The only bits of data that ever leave are signed transactions sent via the chain.so pushtx API.

    The code is open source, https://github.com/loon3/Tokenly-Pockets. Feel free to ask me any questions.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    There is a bunch of random stuff you can redeem them for here: https://redeem.tokenly.com/catalog/adam

    We are working on an official community marketplace which will have a lot more stuff though, should be coming with or shortly after the new redesign.

    Also you do not need the web browser extension at all, you can use CounterWallet, just doesn't have some of the same integrations (like being able to send to an LTB username instead of an address). Definitely a huge need for more and better counterparty compatible wallets though.

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    [–]frankenmint 1 point an hour ago

    I said what I said because I've tried already using the counterparty wallet and it fails to confirm signatures so I cannot link my ltbcoin balances to anything nor can I redeem any of the other types of tokens.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point 1 hour ago

    Yeah, the signature signing bug is extremely annoying in Counterwallet, and is another one of the reasons we wanted to build our own wallet (which BTW the signing process is super easy on the chrome extension). I'd be happy to donate a small amount of BTC to pay for either the transaction broadcast or proof-by-donation methods for address verification, just PM me (or I can even manually verify for you).

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    [–]AdamBLevine 1 point just now

    Just so you know, you only need to verify an address if you want to use Token Controlled Access - If you want to spend or redeem, you can use swapbots https://tokenrank.tokenly.com

    There are currently 18 different swaps that accept LTBCOIN on tokenrank.

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    [–]127fascination 2 points 11 hours ago

    Yes, that's when I stopped listening.

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    [–]pinhead26 16 points 10 hours ago

    Why? The content is still great and relevant. Bitcoin podcasts like LTB are important for expanding the overall knowledge base and bringing new users on board.

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    [–]Andaloons 6 points 10 hours ago

    Agreed. And it's an important experiment using Counterparty on top of bitcoin. Also the Tokenly SwapBots are BADASS.

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    [–]nogravityforce 5 points 9 hours ago

    Yeah, can you believe they experimented with Bitcoin tech to create their own micro crypto currency for their community, just like you expect people to leverage this amazing technology. Nothing has made me angrier.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    I always find it funny when people want bitcoin to be successful, but get angry if you use it too much ("how dare you make thousands of transactions!"), or use it in some other way they don't approve or immediately understand.

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    [–]frankenmint 1 point an hour ago

    I think he was being sarcastic.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    Yes I know :)

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    [–]winlifeat 0 points 9 hours ago

    You can leverage the technology without an altcoin. Understand the scammy history of altcoins

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    [–]nogravityforce 2 points an hour ago

    Did you even try to understand the point of LTBcoin? I guess not?

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    [–]winlifeat 0 points an hour ago

    I'm not going to argue whether it's a good idea or a bad idea (seems kind of useless though) but historically in the bitcoin communities altcoins have usually not worked out to well and ended with a large loss for all but a few people.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 2 points an hour ago

    Just as an FYI, LTBCOIN is actually a token embedded within the bitcoin blockchain, so every single transaction made using LTBCOIN is actually both a bitcoin transaction and an LTBCOIN transaction.

    As to why we can't just use bitcoin, here's an example we developed last summer called Token Controlled Viewpoint, which to summarize allows a website, app or service to use the contents of your bitcoin address as your access token inventory. When you possess a given token that corresponds to a rule, power or permission within the app, website or service then the system gives the associated user whatever should be granted according to their tokens.https://letstalkbitcoin.com/blog/post/tcv

    You can't do that with just bitcoin because you can only have different amounts of the bitcoin token. Using counterparty, you can have literally thousands or millions of different assets each in unique amounts associated with a single bitcoin address. Those tokens can control different rules at different websites and services, those tokens cannot be reposessed or removed by the platform you're using them on, they are owned by the user the same as bitcoins are.

    This is incredibly powerful and not possible using bitcoin without something like counterparty built on top of it.

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    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    Counterparty tokens are not alt-coins. http://counterparty.io/

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    [–]AdamBLevine 1 point an hour ago

    Really lol? The one thing you couldn't abide was a rewards program built on bitcoin given out for free?

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    [–]moeabdol 0 points 11 hours ago

    exactly!

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    [+]utuxia[S] comment score below threshold (5 children)

    [–]SumatranOrganic 1 point 9 hours ago

    It has a market cap of $34,500 and has 3 trading-pairs on two exchanges. Seems to be working out very well for the currency of a crypto podcast.

    http://coinmarketcap.com/assets/ltbcoin/#markets

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    [–]Onetallnerd 7 points 8 hours ago

    With $5 24 hour volume! Looks healthy... /s

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    [–]AdamBLevine 1 point 31 minutes ago

    You can find other ways to use/acquire LTBCOIN at our Swapbot Vending Machine search engine, tokens like LTBCOIN don't make a ton of sense in exchanges because they aren't applicable to most of the people using the exchange, so we've created a service that lets anybody run an automated token vending machine and sell/accept whatever tokens they want.

    https://tokenrank.tokenly.com

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    [–]ekc78 2 points 5 hours ago

    Well it worked out just as well as every other alternative cryptocurrency out there

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    [–]cryptonaut420 2 points an hour ago

    Still around over a year later, so actually we are beating a lot of other alts :) of course LTBC isn't really an alt though, it's a counterparty token.

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    [–]romerun 1 point 3 minutes ago

    It allows LTB to inflate their currency, a thing cannot be done in Bitcoin. Also, imagine if they just handed users a few bits in bitcoin, they would just keep them or spend somewhere else, defeating the purpose.

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    [–]GreatGuy_GG 0 points 4 hours ago

    They were distributing the coins to people 'contributing' to their forum and blog. Mostly resulted into bad articles being published.

    Seems like the coin was removed from exchanges as well(?).

    Here's the link to the coin's website.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 4 points an hour ago

    Still are distributing, although we've now left the "easy ltbcoin" stage.

    you can see the weekly distribution schedule and allocations here.

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1GzytNblMx8xBmUczX7sPC8QitkJrrRirNrh2AJtjy1Q/edit?usp=sharing

    permalink save parent report give gold reply [–][deleted] an hour ago

    [deleted]

    [–]cryptonaut420 1 point an hour ago

    https://letstalkbitcoin.com/

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    [–]Avatar-X -1 points 9 hours ago

    They still try somewhat. Horrible idea. But maybe it did paid off. Only Adam knows.

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    [–]AdamBLevine 2 points 59 minutes ago

    Depends what you mean by Paid Off

    If by that you mean that it's an ongoing experiment that we're developing solutions to fit the needs of, then it's definitely paid off.

    We had more problems and ran into more unexpected difficulties as a result of launching LTBCOIN as the earliest crypto-rewards program which led to the creation of a whole suite of open source tools that solve the problem not just for LTB but for anybody who wants to do something with a token built on bitcoin.

    If you're asking if I got rich off the wild success of LTBCOIN price, that'd be a no, but that was never the expectation. I am the largest holder of LTBCOIN unsuprisingly because I create more content for the network than just about anybody else and for much of the early period my content was more popular than everybody elses. You can take a look at all the stats here on this page, you'll find the rewards program leaderboards at the very bottom of the page.

    https://letstalkbitcoin.com/ltbcoin-stats

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    [–]sgornick -2 points 5 hours ago

    Here's a little different approach:

    Write For Qntra, Earn Equity In Qntra

    http://qntra.net/2014/10/write-for-qntra-earn-equity-in-qntra

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    [–]AdamBLevine 4 points an hour ago

    LTBCOIN was the first ever crypto community rewards program and at the time as now saying things like "equity" is inviting trouble. Creating something that acts like equity is inviting trouble.

    So we didn't launch something that looked like Equity, we launched something that looked a lot like Bitcoin - People didn't buy new tokens, they earned them through a competitive process where everyone including the creators were on equal footing. Not a single person bought LTBCOIN, it's all been distributed according to our published plan (linked in an earlier reply)

    Lots of people have been less conservative than we have, I've got no problem with that I just like my life and don't want to find myself on the wrong end of a retroactive cryptoequity ruling years down the road.

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    [–]zerovivid -4 points 10 hours ago

    Pepperidge Farm Remembers

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  • Cryptonaut

    @goefells There is one comment talking about the nature of LTBCoin and content creation--the aim was to bootstrap a community and content creators together through some reward based system. This, it hoped, would create a viable audience for advertising and cycle up content creation. Since joining LTB there is definitely much less content on the site in written format, and while there are a lot more podcasts, not many people can sit at their desks for an hour or so to listen.

    An interesting article can take 20 minutes to read.

    I dunno, I kind sorta agree with that commenter--what exactly has happened to the LTBC experiment? Has it now become fully embraced in a Tokenly fashion? It's not content that is important, it's merchandise and services now built on top of Tokenly that utlise LTBCoin?

    Instead of diverse content for the audience, are we merely shoppers now with a little bit of content side dish? I don't particularly mind how LTBCoin is used, it's always been about the content here for me(have not ever sold a single LTBCoin :P), but what is exactly happening with the LTBCoin experiment? Is Tokenly a pivot which has dragged LTBCoin with it?

    Things are still chugging along, and content is still being posted almost every day, but yeah definitely heavily weighted on the podcaster side, and the forums are pretty slow most days. Interesting that when we added a bunch of features to our backend blogging / editorial sections, we actually got less submissions, so we definitely need to rethink some things on the content creator side. ..

    IMO these are the main issues:

    • The website is in desperate need of a redesign. The current version is an improvement over the old simple wordpress blog, but to be frank this design was whipped together based off a couple static mockups delivered only days before we were supposed to launch the new site... but yeah, a redesign is coming later this month, working on it as we speak actually. Part of the redesign is also more advertising space to sell (not too much, don't worry), instead of just the 2 spots we currently have.
    • Development efforts have been mostly siphoned off from the main LTB platform (the CMS), to Tokenly products. This is true - but it also is all going to tie together, as you will see very soon. We found that almost everything we wanted to try or do with LTBC required custom solutions, having to build in our own payment processing for different functions (blog submission credits, TCA boards, buying advertisements or sponsorship), token distribution, token vending, TCA etc... so we came to the conclusion that it was better to have these things as properly built, more scalable services which can not only be used by LTB, but by any other token project.
    • We have never really actively promoted or advertised ourselves. Everything is just organic traffic, posts to reddit and the standard social media channels.

    So in other words, need to pretty this place up, make some upgrades and do some promotion. The first two are my department, @adam can maybe say more on advertising and getting more content creation though

    Chief Architect - Let's Talk Bitcoin!
    Co-Founder - Tokenly
    Owner - IronClad Web Technologies
    BITCOINEX - SPECULATE - EARNFREEBTC - BOOKKEEPER - IRONCLADWEB
    Adbit.co Bitcoin Advertising

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  • fistone

    LTBcoin not ponzy, your get ltbcoin in here only active in forum you can get free ltbcoin every week

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  • odolvlobo

    @davidareallen For those that want to see the comments without going to Reddit: ...

    That was annoying. Couldn't you have just posted a link to pastebin instead of posting the whole reddit here?

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  • odolvlobo

    If speculators can't accept losses, then they need to find a new hobby.

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  • davidareallen

    @odolvlobo

    @davidareallen For those that want to see the comments without going to Reddit: ...

    That was annoying. Couldn't you have just posted a link to pastebin instead of posting the whole reddit here?

    I could have, but not everyone uses reddit or understands pastebin. Sorry for the inconvenience it may have caused you.

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