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"Posts That Pay" Forum Anti-Spam System Proposal

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  • deweller

    @adam But LTBCOIN is not like microsoft points, this is why I think its better to have an abstraction that can be fixed value and literally be property that people purchase for its utility. It's functionally the same in terms of what it does for us, but it's a use of LTBCOIN not LTBCOIN itself which we want to have all its functions wherever it is being used. If we integrate LTBCOIN it should be two way.

    I agree a two-way integration is the ideal thing here.

    But I'm trying to avoid it because I think a one-way implementation is significantly easier when dealing with the legal and security issues.

    Co-Founder and CTO of Tokenly

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  • adam

    @deweller

    @adam But LTBCOIN is not like microsoft points, this is why I think its better to have an abstraction that can be fixed value and literally be property that people purchase for its utility. It's functionally the same in terms of what it does for us, but it's a use of LTBCOIN not LTBCOIN itself which we want to have all its functions wherever it is being used. If we integrate LTBCOIN it should be two way.

    I agree a two-way integration is the ideal thing here.

    But I'm trying to avoid it because I think a one-way implementation is significantly easier when dealing with the legal and security issues.

    As am I, that's my point. If we don't allow LTBCOIN to enter our database-driven ecosystem and instead have a fixed LTBCOIN price denominated credit that is redeemed within our system for posting on the forums to power this anti-spam system than we get all the advantages without needing to make anything two way because there is an obvious path to getting LTBCOIN out of the system, following the rules and making non-spam posts.

    If we try to creat LTBCOIN credits we have all kinds of problems because we are representing LTBCOIN as both a token on counterparty and in our system, which has major issues. If we just use LTBCOIN payments on the blockchain to buy another fixed LTBCOIN denominated credit we have none of that problem and can do whatever we want because it is not directly comparable to LTBCOIN the token.

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  • deweller

    Mmmm... ok. I feel a little silly for not seeing that at the beginning. But this approach makes sense to me now.

    So, in my mind, this is a LTB Points system. But we don't call it ltbcoincredits. We call it something else and the ratio of LTBCOIN to points is not 1 to 1.

    For some reason, I have it in my head that the credit was only for forum posts. Can we use the internal credit (points) for other things? Would it be a divisible token that we could use for tipping small amounts?

    Some quick brainstorming examples of what we might want to use the credit for:

    • paying for up or down votes
    • tipping other users and content creators
    • promoting posts
    • buying display ads
    • buying profile flare

    Co-Founder and CTO of Tokenly

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  • adam

    @deweller Mmmm... ok. I feel a little silly for not seeing that at the beginning. But this approach makes sense to me now.

    So, in my mind, this is a LTB Points system. But we don't call it ltbcoincredits. We call it something else and the ratio is different.

    The ratio is different because the thing it gets you is worth more than 1 LTBCOIN, and it is a credit that has utility rather than LTBCOIN which is general. It's important that we don't think about it like an LTBCOIN system, it is selling a product that is denominated in and purchasble with LTBCOIN among other things

    For some reason, I have it in my head that the credit was only for forum posts. Can we use the internal credit (points) for other things? Would it be a divisible token that we could use for tipping small amounts?

    I think it would be good to have a standard denomination and then have more expensive things be multiples of it. i don't think we want fractional credits, thats what LTBCOIN is for.

    I do think that 100 LTBC per credit per post is a small enough number that we could make that the standard denomination since although it is very cheap or even free it's very immediately useful. 1 Credit (100 LTBc with 0% spam rate after using it to make a post) would be the minimum tip in this paradigm but you could totally sell all things for it.

    Some quick brainstorming examples of what we might want to use the credit for:

    • paying for up or down votes
    • tipping other users and content creators
    • promoting posts
    • buying display ads
    • buying profile flare

    Good stuff!

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  • irnhnve

    I think it is quite a few steps for a new user to take just to use the forums. There's people who will take the time to do them, but I feel like it would turn an even larger number away.

    What if instead we simply had new user's accounts flagged until they had received x amount of likes on their posts from full users. It could also be set up in tiers so that x number of likes on a post from a full member gets them to the next tier where they would begin receiving 25% of the distribution they earned during that period, but they rest are set aside in a pool. When they hit the next threshold they get 50% and so so on until they hit 100% at which time all of the LTBc that is set aside in the pool are released and they get the full distribution each week going forward.

    This way an account that has reached a certain tier becomes more valuable to the user since it would be difficult to start all over again if they tried to spam from the high tier account.

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  • adam

    The system described above would be basically invisible to users unless they want to use it. Users only face the need to somehow acquire more posts than they are given for free (whether by recieving them from others users, waiting til they recieve more LTBCOIN from the rewards, or spending a small amount of some kind of value.

    Asking people to get likes is hard because not everybody will, and that's okay.

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  • pooktwo

    @irnhnve I think it is quite a few steps for a new user to take just to use the forums. There's people who will take the time to do them, but I feel like it would turn an even larger number away.

    What if instead we simply had new user's accounts flagged until they had received x amount of likes on their posts from full users. It could also be set up in tiers so that x number of likes on a post from a full member gets them to the next tier where they would begin receiving 25% of the distribution they earned during that period, but they rest are set aside in a pool. When they hit the next threshold they get 50% and so so on until they hit 100% at which time all of the LTBc that is set aside in the pool are released and they get the full distribution each week going forward.

    This way an account that has reached a certain tier becomes more valuable to the user since it would be difficult to start all over again if they tried to spam from the high tier account.

    @adam Even though is think that the credit system is a great idea, irnhnve is correct that many might not want to go through this process, though i dont think irnhnve's proposed solution is the answer either. I have still been thinking about this in the back of my head for a few days and I will submit an idea when i have one, there has to be a way to make this work because its a really good idea :)

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  • adam

    @pooktwo

    @irnhnve I think it is quite a few steps for a new user to take just to use the forums. There's people who will take the time to do them, but I feel like it would turn an even larger number away.

    What if instead we simply had new user's accounts flagged until they had received x amount of likes on their posts from full users. It could also be set up in tiers so that x number of likes on a post from a full member gets them to the next tier where they would begin receiving 25% of the distribution they earned during that period, but they rest are set aside in a pool. When they hit the next threshold they get 50% and so so on until they hit 100% at which time all of the LTBc that is set aside in the pool are released and they get the full distribution each week going forward.

    This way an account that has reached a certain tier becomes more valuable to the user since it would be difficult to start all over again if they tried to spam from the high tier account.

    @adam Even though is think that the credit system is a great idea, irnhnve is correct that many might not want to go through this process, though i dont think irnhnve's proposed solution is the answer either. I have still been thinking about this in the back of my head for a few days and I will submit an idea when i have one, there has to be a way to make this work because its a really good idea :)

    Right now nobody wants to go through the process :) We're building tools for a different paradigm so I don't really have a problem with the level of engagement we're demanding. Worst case scenario someone does not participate and then they only get the free posts and don't get rewarded for them since they didn't set up an access pocket so their earnings would just be used to rebuy more posts in addition to the free posts (they would also be able to tip with their accumulated posts).

    If they set it up, they can ignore it again even more easily and now also have the option to get LTBCOIN out instead of just more posts.

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  • Cryptonaut

    @adam hope you dont mind me posting this document link here for fleshing out this idea a bit more: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SoeL68h70uTwLmLHGbPYSCsNhsrLLoVsLr4WHxKXE4I/edit

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  • adam

    yup, all good

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